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BigJimnyMeet (North) 2024 (12 Jan 2024)


BigJimnyMeet 2024

14th July 2024
Parkwood Nr. Leeds

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Air Conditioning Problem

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29 May 2011 16:35 #17056 by Obarno
When I bought my Jimny part of the air con had been stripped out to make way for a winch. I've now reinstalled the missing bits and gassed up the system but it won't work. If you feed power to the compressor it will lock in and the system will get cold.
The push button light on the dash will go green if you hold it in, but not if you just latch it in the normal way, but the system still won't work. The car was a push button transfer box type, but now has a Redacted so there are several connectors hanging around by the transfer box.
The question is please, is there a connection between the transfer box and the air con ie when you select 4wd or low range, does it turn the air con off. I have disconnected the wiring to the 4wd controller because all the 4wd and low range lights were on all the time, so the car thinks its in low range regardless of what it actually is as it has a Samurai transfer box. To complicate matters even more, with Martin's very able assistance, I have now got the the 4wd light on the dash to operate when you select 4wd, but only by cutting a wire from the 4wd controller and connecting it to the transfer box. The wiring diagram would seem to suggest that there is a connection between the air con and 4wd controller but if someone who has an original push button car with air con could confirm or otherwise if the air con does turn off in 4wd that would be a great help
Are you still with me!!??

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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29 May 2011 17:26 #17058 by mlines
Replied by mlines on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
The aircon is disabled in 4WD according to the circuit diagrams and the workshop manual. It appears to be in the same circuit as the aircon overpressure switch.

Martin

Martin

2003 M13 early KAP build.
3" Trailmaster lift with 1.5 Spacers on front
Customised winch bumper and roll cage
235/85R16 Maxxis Bighorns on 16" Rims, 4:1 Rocklobster, Rear ARB locker and on-board air
Corrected arms all-round, rear disks, Recaro seats and harnesses

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29 May 2011 18:01 #17060 by Obarno
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
That's great Martin thankyou - do you know how I can fool the 4wd module into thinking its in 2wd? At the minute all the lights are on as if its in low range. I imagine its necessary to connect 2 of the wires that would have gone to the original transfer box.

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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29 May 2011 19:41 #17066 by mlines
Replied by mlines on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
I had to compare an old manual car with an electronic one.

1. An old "manual" car only has a 4WD controller. The transfer box is put into 4WD using the lever, therefore the controller has to detect this and engage the vacuum, thats its only job apart from deciding that certain conditions are wrong and therefore it should refuse to engage the vacuum.

The old controller has 10 connections:

1: Vacuum control valve (output)
2: Vacuum control valve (output)
3. 4WD Light and ABS Controller (this must be an "output")
4. ECU (?)
5. Ground
6. Vacuum sensor switch (input)
7. 4WD Transfer box switch (input)
8. A/C Pressure switch (??)
9. Tacho
10. Power (input)

Therefore the only real inputs on the old controller are 6,7

2. A new electronic car has the 4WD controller and a transfer box controller. The transfer box controller looks at waht buttons you have pushed and controllers the electric motors that drive the transfer box. Using sensors and switches on the transfer box it then decides if you have been successful in your selection and then tells the 4WD controller to engage the vacuum. Therefore it then switches connection 7 on the 4WD controller to earth to signal it to switch the vaccum.

However there is the connection from the 4WD controller to the A/C, but its unclear wether the 4WD tells the A/C that 4WD is on or whether the A/C tells the 4WD that it is on? And both have connections to the ECU. The ECU seems to have master control of the A/C as it controls through relays the compressor and condensor. You should be able to force the the A/C by grounding these connections.

Martin

2003 M13 early KAP build.
3" Trailmaster lift with 1.5 Spacers on front
Customised winch bumper and roll cage
235/85R16 Maxxis Bighorns on 16" Rims, 4:1 Rocklobster, Rear ARB locker and on-board air
Corrected arms all-round, rear disks, Recaro seats and harnesses

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29 May 2011 19:46 - 29 May 2011 19:47 #17068 by facade
Replied by facade on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
Out of interest I had a look, It appears that you need to remove yellow connector E74 from the 4wd controller, located at the right hand side under the dash and join the green/black to green/white.

While you are messing with e74, I reckon joining blue to blue/black will make the 4wd light come on properly if the transfer box switch is connected, or at least earthing the blue wire will light it up.

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)
Last edit: 29 May 2011 19:47 by facade.

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30 May 2011 05:22 #17075 by Obarno
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
Martin and Facade - thank you very much for your help. I am setting off to France today with it (on a trailer!) so won't be able to play with it for a couple of days but will let you know what happens. It would be really good to get it working. Just hope I don't damage the ECU!

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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01 Jun 2011 08:07 #17166 by Obarno
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
I connected green/black to green/white but it didn't do anything. It seems, from the guy who did the installation for me, that there is no live to the a/c switch on the dash, although if you hold the button in, the green a/c light will come on, but it won't come on in by switching it the normal way. Could it be a switch problem?
The green/white appears to be a live, so is it this wire that provides the live to the a/c dashboard switch?

The good news is that the weather here is awful - raining - cold - so I don't need the a/c at the minute!!

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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01 Jun 2011 16:21 - 01 Jun 2011 16:22 #17174 by facade
Replied by facade on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
Have you got the wiring diagrams? p108/109

Can't figure out 100% how the switch works from the diagram, but I'll have a stab.

Looks like switching on the AC will connect the earth end of an LED (likely your green light) to the blue/red wire that goes to the over pressure switch.
The other end of the over pressure switch is the green/black wire that on a 2WD goes straight to the green/white wire or on a 4WD is split to the 4wd controller at the yellow connector(this is the bridge wire I suggested)
Looking at the diagram, this needs to be earthed to get something to happen, so the green/white wire will read as a live as you found.

Inside the blower fan switch there is a long black line connected to the AC switch that would appear to
earth out when the blower is switched on to any speed.

So with the blower fan running, turning on the AC will earth the green LED so it comes on, and earth the blue/red wire. (which will carry on and earth the green/black and carry on to earth the green/white)

The bottom line is earthing the green/white at the AC ecu should put the clutch in.
The green LED tells you the switch is on, not that the AC is working.
No idea why it comes on if you hold the switch, maybe the AC switch is faulty after all.

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)
Last edit: 01 Jun 2011 16:22 by facade.

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02 Jun 2011 10:17 #17227 by Obarno
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
Unfortunately I don't have the wiring diagrams, but I have ordered a late w/shop manual on disc which should also have all wiring diagrams up to 2009. Just waiting on 'La Poste'!

I tried earthing the white/green and the a/c worked fine, the fan and compressor cutting in and out, but uncontrolled by the switch. Also uncontrolled by the fan switch whether off or on. Do you think this points to an a/c switch problem, particularly as the light is intermittent?
If I get a new switch, and connect green/black to green/white, do you think it then will work as it should? Presumably with the yellow plug, unplugged?

Sorry to keep coming back with more questions........................

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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07 Jun 2011 10:35 #17461 by Obarno
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
Well I went to our local friendly Suzuki dealer in Ales yesterday, only to find their computers had gone down and they couldn't tell me anything about the a/c switch. I went back today to find that you cannot buy just the switch on its own, but have to buy the whole of that heater panel. The cost is 117Euros plus vat - hmmm - bit expensive I think incase the switch is not faulty. Also not easy to fit I would imagine as there are cables for the rotary switches, as well as loads of connectors.

So the question Facade please is, do you think the system would work ok if I put in an additional switch which merely earthed the green/white? It seemed to work ok as a temporary measure so I can't really see why not, but your thoughts would be much appreciated. I had thought about getting a hrw switch as there is a space on the dash panel that would take that switch. Would it be sensible to let the switch switch a relay as it controls the lock up on the compressor?

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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07 Jun 2011 16:09 #17478 by facade
Replied by facade on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
Get to the blue/red wire at the air-con switch and earth that to switch the air con on. This will keep the over pressure switch in circuit. You don't need a relay as this is just a signal wire.

There won't be a warning light however, and you shouldn't really run it without the heater fans on.

You could connect a small bulb/led from live to the blue/red wire. then the bulb will light if the switch is on. Not sure why they used a double pole switch to do this originally though, maybe it will cause some problem.

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)

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09 Jun 2011 15:45 #17580 by Obarno
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Air Conditioning Problem
HI Facade - well I took the dash to bits today and earthed the blue/red and it worked fine. I soldered a wire to the blue/red and put the plug into the back of the switch again. I thought that maybe the green a/c light would be back fed and come on, but not so.
I put the yellow plug E74 back into the box with no link wire and it worked OK..
I have ordered a heated rear window switch from Cam Suzuki which will fit nicely into an existing hole in the dash. Great!! Its beginning to get hot down here now so it working will make life a lot more pleasant!
Once again thanks very much for your invaluable help - there is no way I would have got it to work on my own.

Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15

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