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BigJimnyMeet (North) 2024 (12 Jan 2024)


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Transfer lever jumping back into 4WD

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28 Nov 2023 17:45 - 28 Nov 2023 19:19 #252434 by moadi
Hello everyone,

I’ve recently took my 2001 Jimny to a really shady mechanic which also ended up ripping me off and causing damage where you can’t see or know.

Anyway, he replaced the front axle differential and installed diff e-locker on it, the diff locker seems to work fine, no complaints.

I’ve owned the Jimny for 4 years now and everytime I put it in 4WD I saw flashing 4WD light but it always engaged, worked perfectly, and when I disengage and go back to 2WD, it would always disengage no issues at all for years.

The issue I’m facing recently after I took it back is
1. When I put it in 4WD the light doesnt flash anymore (he cut the wires of the sensor on the transfer box for some reason, I fixed it)
2. When I put it back into 2WD after 4WD, and continue driving it doesn’t disengage and the lever shakes hard then goes back into 4WD-h, I have to drive in reverse for a few meters after switching to 2WD for it to disengage
3. I found that some of the vacuum pipes were cut (Not sure if its him or its been like that, I don’t remember if my hubs were fixed)

I really liked how it used to be, just put it in 2WD and keep going, I prefer not to reverse and never had any issues before he messed it up.

Is it natural for it to stay in 4WD unless I reverse? Maybe I didn’t need to reverse before because my vacuum system worked?

He tried convincing me into buying manual locker hubs but I kept saying no so he might have messed the vaccuun system to make me buy it.

I would really appreciate any help or ideas
Last edit: 28 Nov 2023 19:19 by moadi.

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28 Nov 2023 19:38 #252437 by facade
He replaced the front diff with one with a locker, or fitted a locker to it?

There are several different diff ratios.

I never trust anyone else's work, so the first thing I'd do is engage 4wd (with the locker open) and jack up both wheels on one side.

Then mark the lowest point of each wheel, and rotate the back one by hand through 5 turns, then see if the marks still align.
If they are obviously out, the diffs are different, and the transmission is winding up, which is why it won't come out of 4WD.

Tbh, I doubt if it was driving the front wheels before  with the light flashing anyway, unless someone had put the hubs into drive and cut the vacuum lines.

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)
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28 Nov 2023 20:03 #252438 by moadi
He said he took my old “broken” differential out, got a new second hand one and installed the e-locker on it then fitted it, he also said it was 10 bolts which is weird considering my Jimny is 2001 and it should be 8 bolts so I believe you already figured it out.
I will do the wheel check you mentioned first thing tomorrow.

Thanks alot for the help, much appreciated, I’m learning to do everything (hopefully) on my own

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28 Nov 2023 20:20 #252439 by jackonlyjack
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29 Nov 2023 10:44 - 29 Nov 2023 10:46 #252453 by moadi
So I did jack up one side and marked the bottom of both wheels then spun the rear wheel 5 times and stopped on the starting point, the front one came off by a 1/4 rotation.

Is it natural or too much? 

*The markers are the black electrical tape in the pictures attached
Attachments:
Last edit: 29 Nov 2023 10:46 by moadi.

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29 Nov 2023 10:55 #252454 by jackonlyjack
This would imply to me you have fitted a 10 bolt vvt front diff 4:3 ratio 
So miss matched diff's causing gear wind up 
I would say remove the front prop shaft till you sort this out

Did mechanic say he needed to grind axle case to get the diff in 

Definitely do not use 4wd 
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29 Nov 2023 11:13 - 29 Nov 2023 11:15 #252456 by moadi
I see, great catch, thanks again!

What would it take to sort this out tho?
I assume I would have to replace the pinion and ring?
If the installed e-locker is 10 bolts, I would have to stick to 10 bolts ring right? Is there such thing as 10 bolts with the same ratio as my other diff so they can match or will I have to also replace the locker? it’s alot of money and I don’t trust that guy ever touching it again.

He didn’t mention anything about grinding the axle case and I doubt he would if I asked, I guess the only way to find out is taking it out.

What damage could I cause if I keep driving like this? 4WD
Last edit: 29 Nov 2023 11:15 by moadi.

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29 Nov 2023 11:53 - 29 Nov 2023 11:59 #252459 by facade
With it being 1/4 turn out, I'd have thought the front was an auto 4.090 and the back manual 3.909

3.909/4.090 x 5 turns = 4.75 turns.

Or, the front could be a late manual 4.3 and the back an auto 4.090

4.090/4.3 x 5 turns = 4.75 turns

I chose 5 turns as if one was a 4.3 and the other 3.909  10 turns would be near enough one turn out and you wouldn't see anything, but 5 turns would put it half a turn out.

3.909/4.3 X 5 turns = 4.54 turns  1/2 turn out over 5 turns.

Whichever, the 2 diff are different ratio and that is the cause of the problem.

Pull the rear diff and count the teeth, then either get a front that matches and transfer the locker, or pull the front and count the teeth, then get a rear that matches it, BUT this will alter the speed in gears, unless you fit larger tyres that bring the overall ratio back to original.


Now you see why I don't trust anyone else to work on my car...


 

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)
Last edit: 29 Nov 2023 11:59 by facade.
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29 Nov 2023 13:24 - 29 Nov 2023 13:29 #252467 by moadi
Wish I had as much knowledge as you guys, thanks alot, now I understand better what ratios mean.

So basically now I need to match the count of the teeth on the pinion ring in both diffs, is that correct?

I think the challenge will be finding a pinion ring with the same ratio as the rear one and 10 bolts so the locker fits, I don’t even know what fits and what doesn’t, would really appreciate some tips.

Sounds expensive as I’ve already paid too much on the front axle so I’m wondering, will something break if I drive like this (sometimes offroad so I need 4WD)  until I find a better diff? 
 
Last edit: 29 Nov 2023 13:29 by moadi.

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29 Nov 2023 14:23 #252469 by facade
You work out the diff ratio by dividing the number of teeth on the crownwheel by the number of teeth on the pinion.

Probably the pinions are the same and the crownwheels are different, which is why the 4.3 diff is larger diameter (it has more teeth) and won't go in the axle case without grinding the case a little.

If you use 4wd something will definitely break if the surface is grippy, whatever you tested it on was too grippy as it caused all that wind up.

 

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)
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29 Nov 2023 14:59 - 29 Nov 2023 15:42 #252476 by moadi
I see, thanks for explaining the whole ratio thing.

I will remove the rear diff and count the teeth on the crown wheel, then do the front one which will be different, if I understand correctly, the only piece that I need to replace is the crownwheel as the pinion is identical, correct?

Does the transfer box have anything to do with this?

Thanks
Last edit: 29 Nov 2023 15:42 by moadi.

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29 Nov 2023 18:24 #252484 by Busta
If yours is a 2001 manual, and the rear diff hasn't been changed, you need a front diff from a 2002-2005 (non-vvt) manual. They will be the same ratio but with the 10 bolt ring gear.
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