×
BigJimnyMeet (North) 2024 (12 Jan 2024)


BigJimnyMeet 2024

14th July 2024
Parkwood Nr. Leeds

Booking now open - EARLY BIRD DISCOUNTED PRICE

Click HERE for details

× A place for more technical discussions. Please make sure you post in the correct section on the site, this way it keeps the site tidy AND ensures you get a more relevant answer.

Engine rattle on load / acceleration -Mostly solved!

More
18 Aug 2017 18:55 #183488 by yakuza
..

Sent fra min E5823 via Tapatalk

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
21 Aug 2017 06:58 - 21 Aug 2017 09:05 #183518 by yakuza
Seems like this is solved now after removing the broken parts inside the cat.. Sound was present on first test drive, but i guess that when the car gets to breathe more easy that the sensor and ECU gets everything set right. i have not heard the rattle on the last two trips so it might be gone, or engine wasn't warm enough..
Removed the cat -element inside the manifold and got no fault codes as of yet.
Remains to see if the car will pass its "MOT" and emissions is still below the limits.

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.
Last edit: 21 Aug 2017 09:05 by yakuza.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
21 Aug 2017 10:28 #183519 by facade
A few people have removed the insides and still pass the MOT, usually because theirs have blocked up though.

Hope its fixed now B)

I suspect I have this same problem on my Renault Nissan, when the engine is cold it clatters like the engine is coming apart if there is any load on the engine, the noise goes after a few miles. I've inspected the manifold/catalyst from the outside minutely, and the heat shields are all firmly attached and won't make any noise if I twang them. Removing it involves some very rusty nuts about 2 feet up a narrow gap, so it is staying on until it self destructs. :huh:

If it suddenly breaks, go back to the last thing that you did before it broke and start looking there :)
The following user(s) said Thank You: yakuza

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
28 Aug 2017 06:13 - 28 Aug 2017 07:07 #183718 by yakuza

yakuza wrote: Sounds a bit like the sound on older cars when vacuum advance on the ignition was wack. Like the early ignition makes the valves rattle. Going up hill or acceleration makes the noise come, mostly on low revs.
The engine is a Liana 2008 VVT. Car is 2005 VVT.


Solved!

Engine: Liana 2008 VVT M16A 11.1:1 compression rate
ECU: Jimny 2005 VVT M13AA 9.5:1 Compression rate

Filled the tank with 98 octane gasoline and all rattles was gone.

Any chance of just using the Liana ECU, or will other problems occur?

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.
Last edit: 28 Aug 2017 07:07 by yakuza. Reason: typo

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
04 Sep 2017 08:13 #183852 by yakuza
Still looking for the final solution for my pre-ingition pinging. i now know why it is there, and as 98 octane gasoline mostly fixes it, i still would like to know how to fix this. Aussie-owners mostly swap to the M18a wich has allmost the same compression rate as the M13a so the problem is not so big down there. But some of you english guys must have had the same issues as me?

Solution 1: remapping the ECU, but that would mean having to learn how to myself, preferably using elements and settings from a Liana ECU wich i would need to buy..

Solution 2: using the liana ECU -is this possible, straight fit? just to hook it up and reprogram the immobilizer? Other issues?
I can get a used one from a 2008 liana at 120£ in Norway.

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Riccy
  • Riccy's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Banned
  • Banned
    Registered
  • J999 MNY Bashing around Carlisle
More
04 Sep 2017 20:22 #183880 by Riccy
Which throttle body are you using? My 2010 swift vvt engine had electronic throttle body so i bought a 2004 liana body, which bolted straight on and appears identical to the original m13vvt one, except is slightly larger bore. Runs really sweet on bog standard UK unleaded, with occasional go-faster unleaded when im feeling flush ££!

J999 MNY, ULYSSES M18 VVT with ITB's Dyno tested at 130hp

Pickup/tipper, R7me gearbox & 6.4 Rocklobster, 31" Toyo MT, 2x ARB air locker 3.9 diffs in braced axles, 6" total lift, Floating rear conversion, Raptor painted, CB, Recaro's, Caged, etc, etc...

www.youtube.com/user/riclemus

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
05 Sep 2017 11:04 #183885 by yakuza

Riccy wrote: Which throttle body are you using? My 2010 swift vvt engine had electronic throttle body so i bought a 2004 liana body, which bolted straight on and appears identical to the original m13vvt one, except is slightly larger bore. Runs really sweet on bog standard UK unleaded, with occasional go-faster unleaded when im feeling flush ££!


i am using the Jimny TB as the 2008 Liana TB that came with the donor had the same inner diameter.
I'll look into getting a older/bigger TB when ECU / ignition timing issue has been sorted.

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
05 Sep 2017 12:14 #183886 by Busta
I doubt pre-detonation is your problem. Or at least, the Liana doesn't require 98ron fuel so there's no reason why the same engine should in the Jimny. Have you done anything to the timing?
We know the Jimny ecu will run the Liana engine without issues because many people have done it.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
06 Sep 2017 05:29 - 06 Sep 2017 05:38 #183899 by yakuza

Busta wrote: I doubt pre-detonation is your problem. Or at least, the Liana doesn't require 98ron fuel so there's no reason why the same engine should in the Jimny. Have you done anything to the timing?
We know the Jimny ecu will run the Liana engine without issues because many people have done it.


Liana 2008 compression rate (CR) is 11.1
Jimny 2005 is 9.5
i have not told my 2005 M13a ECU that the new engine has another CR so it still ignites when it should for the old engine.
That is the reason for the pre detonation and using 98 octane almost makes it go away completely.
Others have reported the same issues.
Some have also used the M15a swift sport engine with 11.1 and the same issue.

M18 swap done in the southern hemisphere makes no such issues as the CR for that engine is 9.6

If you use earlier Liana engines (pre 2008) with lower compression rates you will not have the same experience..
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suzuki_M_engine#M16A (2008 and newer has 11.1)
(My Liana engine had a smaller TB as well compared to your english ones (older) with bigger diameter. could be other differences as well..)
Also the rattle is kind of intermittent. I used the car for a long time without noticing during daily driving.
When hauling a trailer over a mountain pass with well warm engine the sound was most noticable.

Guess if you live in a flat area, listen too loud music, using worn out spark plugs, not hauling too much and driving nicely you may never notice. :)

www.4x4community.co.za/forum/showthread....-Another-Jimny-sound
www.4x4community.co.za/forum/showthread.php/123577-Jimny-engine

auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=13348

www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f...start=300#wrapheader
>Car still rattles a bit when labouring the motor (do 60km/h stick it in 5th and plant your foot - you'll see what I mean) but thats attributed to a >motor with more torque and power operating on a smaller car with ladder chassis & live axle - or so my mechanic says.
>>no, that is called pinging/pinking technically called pre-ignition... put some higher octane fuel in or set the timing.

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.
Last edit: 06 Sep 2017 05:38 by yakuza.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
06 Sep 2017 19:38 #183915 by Busta
Sorry, I understand the situation now! Ignore me.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
07 Sep 2017 08:55 #183922 by yakuza
No, i do not want to ignore :) It is always wise to challenge the findings as I could be wrong, or at least not open to other solutions. (I have been mistaken before, once back in the nineties :) )
The release of finding what seems to be a plausible solution may cloud our judgement. More so the longer we have been searching for a solution..

anyways i still wonder if i can use the ECU from a Liana or if i have to reprogram the ECU?

Or can i trick the crank position sensor?

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
12 Oct 2017 10:41 - 12 Oct 2017 11:04 #185125 by yakuza
Still having this problem wich may be caused by the difference in compression rate on the donor engine.

I am also experiencing a loss of power above 2000rpm. it does not run as well as it did straight after the engine swap, i have to use one gear lower now in the same hills. Almost as it has its m13a engine back.
Tried resetting the ECU by leaving it without power overnight and i sensed it was a bit more powerful when doing the first test run, but as soon as it was warmed up, and doing the first hill, it was back to its lesser state again.
There is no fault codes or other symptoms. (handbrake warning light stays on but that cannot be it..?)
I have been running it on 98 octane for a while now to reduce the pinging.

Front cat was removed because it was broken, and some parts of it may have cluttered the second cat, but i had the no.2 out and tried to shake out the pieces. Putting the retrieved pieces back together did not add up to one complete cat element though. The pieces was collapsed so difficult to assess this i guess.

I am afraid i will damage my engine if this is not fixed..
www.autos.com/car-maintenance/what-causes-engine-pinging

I have no way of adjusting the ignition other tha ECU remapping right?
No cooling issues that i know of..

Any suggestions what to try to do next?

Norway 2005 Jimny M16A VVT, 235 BFG MT, 2" Trailmaster, ARB rear lck, 17%/87% high/low gears.
Last edit: 12 Oct 2017 11:04 by yakuza.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Time to create page: 0.207 seconds
Powered by Kunena Forum

I hope you enjoy using this forum. Please consider making a donation towards the upkeep of this forum website.

We use cookies to give you the best online experience. Please let us know if you agree to all of these cookies. Accepting the Cookies also accepts the Disclaimers for the website.