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Re:Lockers for the JB74

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14 Jul 2021 21:42 #236689 by sniper
Replied by sniper on topic Lockers for the JB74
The ATB sends equal torque to both wheels, if one wheel is spinning freely (0 torque) then the other wheel will get the same...... It is not a diff locker..

Fiddle brakes will allow me to brake the spinning wheel (thereby adding torque) and give the stationary wheel drive, through the ATB..... What the gen 4 ABS gizmo does but smoother...

The electronics allow a novice driver to make safe progress on quite rough ground..... When the going gets very tricky, the jerky nature of the gizmo's is not the best..... Most modern 4x4's are the same... Capable but not pretty to watch, unless you know how to use them.....

sniper
 

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15 Jul 2021 07:56 #236693 by Roger Fairclough
I had an Eaton Tru-Trac in the rear diff. of my LC and Eaton recommended that a quick dab on the footbrake or a yank on the h/brake would activate the diff. if you had a wheel in the air. Basically a fiddle brake situation without the complication of a fiddle brake system.

Roger

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15 Jul 2021 09:03 #236696 by sniper
Replied by sniper on topic Lockers for the JB74
Dabbing the brakes does get some power across the ATB but it is a last ditch (excuse pun) tool, you are braking both wheels and there is only a small point where power is given to the stationary wheel, before it's own braking, cancels it out....  You can do it on open diffs to some extent, Jack is a master of left foot braking on open diffs whilst trialling, in the hunt for grip.

With my handbrake on my transfer case,  very simple fiddle brakes will give perfect control of the power being applied to the stationary wheel. Giving all of the on road benefits of the ATB plus (and a very big +) that of a clutch controlled, diff locker, off road..... Add to that a tiny turning circle and it will be a very worthwhile modification and way smoother than the jerky nature of electronic 4x4.

I would suggest that every Jimny driver, drive a car fitted with an ATB, regardless of generation or type of use. They really do bring a lot to the table, especially if you are a "spirited" driver...... 

sniper

 
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15 Jul 2021 11:54 #236700 by 300bhpton
Replied by 300bhpton on topic Lockers for the JB74
Not knocking fiddle brakes at all, but they can still be jerky to use and more prone to human error. As you'll never be able to react as fast as the computer does.

Also when sitting in a vehicle is can be very difficult to actually tell which wheel is spinning. So I think most people tend to pull both levers and then yank them back and forth in the hope of it providing more traction. Which it normally will, but isn't exactly graceful and a little ham fisted in its use and approach. Also, the TCS shouldn't really be that jerky, at least none that I've used or driven with.

Brake steering is something very different, which they are very good for.
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15 Jul 2021 15:25 #236706 by sniper
Replied by sniper on topic Lockers for the JB74
Fiddle brakes... jerky? .... can't see how unless the person controlling the levers has the DT's...... hydraulics are generally smooth....

Not reacting as quick as the computer is a positive thing in the situation described.....

I can usually tell which wheel will spin before I enter the obstacle... certainly once traction is lost..... especially if a wheel is lifted.

I've escorted a novice driver go over Gatescarth Pass in a gen4 press car, more jerky than a jerky thing, across a rocky technical trail.....  drove a little myself and it was an automaton... keep throttle on and it will compute progress, not pretty... but it works.....

I'm surprised as an owner that you disagree, maybe you haven't had real need for the drive systems to intervene much, when you have been off road....  Up a 40deg rocky incline with hairpin switchbacks, it did and it was not smooth at all....

sniper

 

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15 Jul 2021 16:21 #236708 by Roger Fairclough
Sniper,

I fully agree with your last paragraph re: everyone trying an ATB diff. as the Tru-Trac was a revelation in the way it controlled the back end.

Roger

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15 Jul 2021 16:47 #236709 by Lambert
Replied by Lambert on topic Lockers for the JB74
When I was playing with the traction control on Temeraire it was noticeably more violent than I was expecting, almost like it was trying to bounce the car past the obstruction. That said, at the meet while I didn't get crazy, the electronics didn't appear fire once, however on previous ventures out to parkwood in Dreadnaught some of the same obstacles were able to cause wheel spin. How much of that is down to the automatic vs manual Goodrich vs Bridgestone electronics vs open diff I have no idea?

Temeraire (2018 quasar grey automatic)
The last of the gen3s, probably.

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15 Jul 2021 19:06 #236712 by mlines
Replied by mlines on topic Re:Lockers for the JB74
When we were at Aldermaston I specifically took Gerald (littleJimny) out to test all the modes.

I was also surprised at how much energy you had to feed into the traction system in order for it have something it could work with. This certainly meant bouncing or leaping out of obstructions instead of a gently crawl. Mind you, the electronic systems on my first range rover sports were very similar and needed energy in the system to work although the latest one has real diff locks.

Sent from my moto g(8) power using Tapatalk

Martin

2003 M13 early KAP build.
3" Trailmaster lift with 1.5 Spacers on front
Customised winch bumper and roll cage
235/85R16 Maxxis Bighorns on 16" Rims, 4:1 Rocklobster, Rear ARB locker and on-board air
Corrected arms all-round, rear disks, Recaro seats and harnesses

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15 Jul 2021 19:58 #236715 by Gadget
Replied by Gadget on topic Re:Lockers for the JB74
Agree that although the TC on the Gen4 works well, it's anything but smooth. The computer doesn't anticipate the wheel spin, but reacts to it and is very 'lurchy'. A proper locking diff would give a much more progressive experience off road.

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15 Jul 2021 21:48 #236718 by GrelloJimny
Replied by GrelloJimny on topic Re:Lockers for the JB74
Does anyone know of any auto lockers made for the Gen 4 Jimny?
As far as I know Lokka’s and Lock Right systems don’t.
Or any good e-lockers out there?

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15 Jul 2021 21:57 #236719 by Boris Ekner
Replied by Boris Ekner on topic Re:Lockers for the JB74
4xfourart.com told me they have lockers for Gen4, one auto locker (like LockRight/Lokka) that will fit the rear diff, and one air locker (like ARB)
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